Wednesday, May 23, 2012

"You're not being insulted, you're being honored!"




Because it's not insulting to be told that you cannot speak in a gathering of believers because your voice is shameful. (1. Cor. 14:35)


It's not demeaning to be told you are too emotional to make good decisions for your life because God made you this way.


It's not insulting to be told you need another human to complete your life's calling and your design. Without him, you fail for the very purpose for which you were created.


It's not demeaning to be told you were created only to help men, a second-class person. 


It's not demeaning to be taught that men were created in the image of God, but you, a woman, only reflect that image through men.


It's not demeaning to be given a list of all the things that you cannot do because you are female, then told that this is honoring and respectful and you should be thankful to be surrounded by godly men that "value" you enough to put limits on you.


It's not hurtful to be told you cannot have your own vision or calling for your life, you must take on the vision and calling of whatever man you are given to.


It's not insulting to be told that your natural gifts, talents, dreams, and desires are never to be fulfilled because you have a vagina and must spend your life fulfilling someone else's. That these dreams and talents are from Satan, a distraction from what you really should be doing.


It's not insulting to be told that men cannot learn anything from you because you are a woman. 


It's not hurtful to be taught to "stay in your place" and told this makes you valuable and acceptable as a woman of God...that stepping out of the "role" this place gives you makes you unworthy of the title "godly woman".


It's not insulting to be treated as inferior in God's eyes and the eyes of His people, while they proclaim hypnotically "you're not inferior....just different!" And this statement is used to keep you from doing whatever they deem you're too feminine, too "different" from them to do. 


As if changing the definitions of words and actions, and saying these over and over again, changes the words and actions themselves and causes us to believe that up is down and right is wrong. That disrespect is actually honor and being put down is actually being lifted up. That being limited and bound is actually being freed and valued. 


It's not inferior if it's "God's way". It's not insulting if it's "Biblical". It's not demeaning if you just "have the right attitude". It's not insulting, inferior, or demeaning if you put on a smile and pretend it's beautiful, fulfilling, and satisfying. And then call everyone who isn't very good at pretending, a "feminist", "selfish", "worldly" and "an enemy of God" and "hater of God's design". 


Well......it worked, didn't it???





"Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter." Isa. 5:20






33 comments:

  1. Just like wearing a burka and having female genitalia mutilated is all about honor and 'making' pure.

    As if a girl wasn't created as pure as a boy in the first place.

    *Shudder*

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  2. You obviously do not have the proper authoritarian personality which would allow you to hold many contradictory viewpoints simultaneously. See:
    http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/
    (I know it's a long read, but it explains so much about fundamentalists.)

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  3. "As if changing the definitions of words and actions, and saying these over and over again, changes the words and actions themselves and causes us to believe that up is down and right is wrong."

    Sadly, this is actually true for many people in many circumstances. It takes a LOT of work to resist. Work you are doing here. Thank you.

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  4. A lot of arguments I've heard for women submitting is that men are insecure, and women have to do this out of consideration for the fragile little status-based egos of men. To me, that seems like a personal problem some men have and why it's my job to prop up someone's insecurities is beyond me. The same people who seem to present men as made of glass and in need of submissive women to feel big and important don't seem to extend that same courtesy to other people who feel insecure.

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  5. Well, if you are given authority (!) to speak, you would be held responsible for what you taught! You wouldn't want that, would you? Let the men bear the greater burden and be glad you got off easy -- right? How condescending and infantilizing. Yes, my youth pastor told me this.

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  6. There is a LOT of talk about how submission "removes burdens" from women--the burden of being judged for teaching, the burden of being held responsible for decisions, the burden of constant toil to support the family, and the burden of being held responsible to God if you sin or make a mistake.

    The problem is, this isn't real!! Submitting does not necessarily take away any "burdens" from a woman's life. If a family makes a bad decision, or a sinful decision, God does not step in and make sure that the harmful consequences ONLY affect the "responsible" party (the husband) and not the wife as well. We've seen enough of life to know this simply isn't true.

    I remember watching a video where Mark Driscoll answered a question from the audience regarding whether it was OK for a mother to work outside the home IF SHE WANTED TO while the dad stayed with the kids. Driscoll answered the question by dodging it; he said it was sinful for a man to "make" his wife provide because provision was the man's "burden" and so should not be thrust off on someone else. In order to hold that view, Driscoll had to completely ignore what the anonymous couple had just told him (that the woman actively wanted to work). He had to pretend that they had in fact said the exact opposite.

    My point here is that the very act of sheltering women often becomes the burden. When women feel they have no voice, are trapped in their life circumstances, and aren't in control of what happens to them...that is the burden. And that's going to be the case no matter how you try to dress the situation theologically.

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  7. Believe me, as a queer person, I get this redefinition problem. Only in our case, it's "loving" to tell us how much of an abomination we are, or that we're going to hell, or that Jesus can make integral parts of us "better", or any number of other things. Nothing is so frustrating as being told that you're being beaten (really or metaphorically) for your own good, and that is largely what you seem to be talking about.

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  8. Reminds me of the old excuse for slavery - God made white people superior, so it was clearly right that whites had to 'protect' black people by enslaving them - they weren't able to look after themselves!

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  9. Yes, woe to those who call evil, good! Like those who lie and deceive! And those who deny the truth of the Bible time and time again. God's word shall stand forever. And remember, even Satan believes in God. It's not good enough to just believe in God but one must live their life for God and follow His commandments! :)

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    1. Interesting comment. I have no idea what it has to do with my post but OK. :P

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    2. I was repeating the verse at the end of your post and agreeing with it. So true of the time we live in today.. evil is called good. Lying is called truth and so on.
      It's all around us now! Morals are out the window and even though we live in the "end times"... God is still good and His word stands forever!

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  10. Those who hold those views have no idea how damning those views are to the souls of women nor do they care. They are indeed preaching another gospel and don't even realize it.

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  11. Amazing post! Thanks! :)

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  12. "It's not inferior if it's "God's way". It's not insulting if it's "Biblical".

    You nailed it. If they read it in the Bible, all critical thinking stops. And if you don't agree with them, you're "divisive".

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    1. Or "Throwing out scripture". :P

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  13. Jeremiah 5:3,4 O LORD, are not thine eyes upon the truth? thou hast stricken them, but they have not grieved; thou hast consumed them, but they have refused to receive correction: they have made their faces harder than a rock; they have refused to return.
    Therefore I said, Surely these are poor; they are foolish: for they know not the way of the LORD, nor the judgment of their God.

    Remember.... God did warn about the times we are in now!

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  14. Someone referred us to your blog. You have so much hate for these teachings you have become extreme and you don't give an accurate description of what people believe or why they believe them. It's very misleading. It's no better than those who get extreme with the things you rant and rave about. You should encourage people to read the books, mostly the whole Bible, and talk to people who believe these things in a rational manner and make informed decisions. I believe many of these teachings are God's loving gifts in His Word to sinful people who need guidance, but I have never beat anyone over the head with them. I would gladly sit down with you with a Bible and a cup of tea anytime and explain why I believe what I believe.

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    1. I'm curious, do you think I made all these statements up for the purpose of "misrepresenting" people? Every single thing I wrote above has been personally told to me by parents, Bible teachers, pastors, and authors of books. I couldn't make this stuff up if I tried or desired to.

      I *do* hate these teachings, as I hate every teaching that uses the Name of Jesus to control and manipulate and bring people down and that perverts the very character of our loving God. That promotes the commandments of men over the teachings of Jesus. That adds to the Bible in a way that damages and hurts people. That turns the grace of God into a cruel joke.

      I hate these teachings in the same way that Jesus hated the teachings of the Pharasees and passionately spoke against them in Matt. 23: "For they bind heavy burdens, hard to bear, and lay them on men's shoulders....Woe to you, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of heaven against men!..woe to you...fools and blind!...brood of vipers...whitewashed tombs who look beautiful on the outside but inside are full of dead men's bones...blind guides who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel..."

      Jesus was much more harsh and "hateful" then I have ever dared to be against those that hurt other people in the name of God. He "ranted and raved" more than I ever have. So did Paul, btw, and many other godly people were angered at what men have done to God's children by binding burdens that were too hard to bear. I'm sure you would've called them "extreme" too, so I take that as a compliment.

      I have misled no one. I only tell my story and the story of countless others, some who were driven away from God by these very teachings. I have found healing and grace but many have not and my heart breaks for them. So I write. I tell it like it is; I tell our story. And some hate me for it, while some cry tears of gratitude. If your story is different than mine, that's wonderful. But that doesn't make me wrong and you right and it doesn't invalidate my story. You talk like I'm just an observer in these things. You couldn't be more wrong. Obviously you haven't read much of my blog. I LIVED this. I WAS you. I PREACHED these things I now speak against. I know whereof I speak. I have the scars to prove it.

      I'm glad you've never "beat anyone over the head" with your beliefs. Unfortunately, you are the minority. Many have done just that and many more are the products of such actions. Do not discount their pain because you have not personally inflicted it. I hope by reading my blog your small perspective is broadened a bit. I've seen a lot of ugly in conservative christendom and it needs to be exposed and brought to the light. I will continue to do so until God tells me otherwise.

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  15. "It's not demeaning to be told you are too emotional to make good decisions for your life because God made you this way."

    Yes, God made you that way. He made you perfectly. But.... He also expects each one of us to have common sense and not make decisions based on emotions alone. That's the key... don't let emotions sway us but facts, Scripture and advice from those who are older and wiser than us. In the end, the decisions are ours but they should be made after the emotions have died down a bit.

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    1. Last I checked, I'm not too emotional to make good decisions. And I certainly have no reason to believe God "made me that way". This is an idea that was created by men to control women and I reject the notion entirely. I also reject the idea that men can make better decisions for me purely because they have a penis and I do not. Pure BS.

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    2. Just quoting what you quoted... and in general women are more emotional than men. That's NOT a bad thing, Darcy; embrace it!! God created women to be that way.
      But I have seen so many women act on emotion and it has caused trouble in their lives/relationships. I think it's wise to take a few minutes or however long it takes to think about the decisions with the emotions put aside and common sense in place. Talk about with the ones you love and those who love you- your husband, parents or whomever it may be.
      That is all I was saying.
      It has nothing to do with male anatomy.

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    3. Even if it is the case that women are more emotional than men on the average, that doesn't mean any specific woman, Darcy in this case, is more emotional than the average man, any predetermined % of men, or even any specific man. It also doesn't imply that her emotions prevent her from making the right choices.

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    4. "God created women to be that way."

      Then I guess we disagree at a foundational level. I see nothing in scripture or logic or life that confirms this statement. And certainly nothing that would say that using this theory is a good reason to tell women they are incapable of making good choices. Which is the reason I said what I did.

      This statement you made: "But I have seen so many women act on emotion and it has caused trouble in their lives/relationships"...I could just as easily make about many men I've known. Making decisions based on emotions is a *people* thing, not a woman thing. And using it as an excuse to not allow someone to make their own decisions is wrong, controlling, and an abuse of authority. Then, on top of that, declaring God made them so if heaping injury upon insult. I reject it all.

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    5. Amen, DArcy! I, too, reject the whole 'men are from mars, women are from venus' thing that the patriarchals and others try to claim is biblical. Nothing in the bible describes pink and blue emotional attributes of men and women. Nothing. Culture and hormonal variations may result in some of these things, but the bible doesn't support them from an intrinsic, pre-fall standpoint.

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    6. So are you okay with homosexuality then? Cause God isn't. He created men and women to be different. Period. there's a reason why he created Eve from Adam's rib. Plus it's symbolic.

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    7. "He created men and women to be different. Period."

      Sorry, that statement still doesn't imply that women are more emotional than men. And I'm not sure what homosexuality or the rib have to do with any of the above points.

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    8. "Being different" is not the same as one being over the other. You can "be different" and still be completely equal, without anyone ruling over another. All these teachings I stated here imply, if not outright state, that man is superior to woman and in authority over her. THAT, and the practical living-out of those teachings, is what I am vehemently against.

      My stance on homosexuality has nothing to do with anything I wrote here. Way to throw in a red herring.

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    9. My goodness, a woman working outside the home doesn't make her a homosexual. I'm trying not to laugh, but that's just bizarre thinking.

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  16. oh my... just read this this morning and thought of your good article "Women should thank the police for the ban." Article: Iran bans women from public screenings of Euro 2012 football http://www.egyptindependent.com/news/iran-bans-women-public-screenings-euro-2012-football

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  17. oh my yes. sad how much of this twisting of words is so common place in many of our churches.
    (I came over here from MPT blog, when I when you saw you are an x-ati. Me, too. Ah!)

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  18. It's a very short hop from a "christian" patriarchal mindset to Sharia Law. It scares me how this mindset of woman being too, well, too womanly, would disqualify her from being the person GOD created her to be....not what some man who has been indoctrinated in the patriarchal movement has decided what she should be. I am so much more than my female parts.
    Kathy F.

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  19. Thank you for putting this in plain language. We have been living under these teachings, obscured by "Christian" "love" and "piety" for too long, and are just now trying to find our way out of the fog.

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